Good Moms Play with Their Kids Like This and Why Sticker Charts are ADHD Hell from the Badass Moms Podcast with Guest Host Kelly Donahue - Best of Friends Series #195
Do you feel like motherhood’s been kind of a raw deal?
Meet my friend Kelly Donahue, founder of Badass Moms. Kelly and I were in the same Integrative Life Coach certification course and I fell in love with her spunky spirit and gentle tough love.
She just launched her podcast earlier this year, talking to women who found their fun and let go of the impossible “selfless mother” standard we were raised with. If you’re ready to ask for what you want, have more fun, and dismantle internalized patriarchy, this show is for you.
In this episode, Kelly and I chat about how much I hate sticker charts when they turn into shame highlighters, and how I can’t stand imaginative play with my kids on her podcast, Badass Moms. And I have zero shame about that.
Kelly shares:
On this episode of Badass Moms, host Kelly Donahue speaks with Patricia Sung, an adult ADHD coach and speaker, about how moms with ADHD can rise above the overwhelm and build a life they love in a way that works with their ADHD brain. They discuss practical strategies for managing time and achieving goals, and how to find confidence in running both family and work life. The episode aims to support moms who have ADHD or suspect they have it to lead their family well while enjoying motherhood.
Be sure to subscribe to the Badass Moms Podcast!
Kelly’s website: https://badassmoms.com/
Kelly’s instagram: @kellydonahue_badassmoms
Find our episode details here: https://open.spotify.com/episode/4nMMYRpoKrDQdevRih2jzb
While I’m slowing down for the summer, making space for more family time and accounting for our emergency construction project, I simply couldn’t leave you hanging for the next few weeks. And my ADHD brain didn’t want to do another vanilla Best Of series… Cue Light Bulb!
Welcome to the Best Of Friends Series, where you are meeting a few of my favorite friends in the podcast community. I’m sharing interviews that I have done on other friends’ podcasts. Not only do you get a new episode, I hope that you’ll find a few shows to add to your podcast queue. There’s a wide variety of topics coming your way, so keep an eye out for a new friend each week of the summer.
Craving people who understand how you work instead of judging you???
Come hang out with me and other ADHD Moms in our twice weekly Successful Mama Meetups!
Patricia Sung 00:02
Are you overwhelmed by motherhood and barely keeping your head above water? Are you confused and frustrated by how all the other moms make it look so easy. You can figure out how to manage the chaos in your mind, your home, or your family. I get your mama, parenting with ADHD is hard. Here is your permission slip to let go of the Pinterest worthy visions of organization and structure fit for everyone else. Let's do life like our brains do life creatively, lovingly, and with all our might. When we embrace who we are and how our brains work, we can figure out how to live our lives successfully, and in turn, lead our families well, at the end of the day, we just want to be good moms. but spoiler alert, you are already a great mom. ADHD does not mean you're doomed to be a hot mess. Mama, you can rewrite your story from shame spiral to success story. And I'll be right here beside you to cheer you on. Welcome to Motherhood in ADHD. Hey there successful mama, it's your friend Patricia Sung. Welcome to our summer best of series. Now over the summer, I'm going to be taking a break to slow down a little bit hanging out more with my kids. I'm also managing and like why am I seeing slowing down there is no slowing down, I just have to reshift priorities here, hanging out my kids dealing with all of the construction project that's been going on. It has been a lot this spring. And I realized like I gotta let up this summer, in order to be able to do all the things, shifting some stuff around. So it's like how do I still deliver great content, but also like, not just do the same old, same old because Hello, ADHD. So here's what we're doing, I am going to be sharing some friends with you. So while I will sprinkle in a couple of episodes from my own podcast, I chose some of the ones that were like the most popular downloads in the last few months. But I think that they are the most popular downloaded episodes because they cover a lot of the like basic things that we need to know about our ADHD. And we could use a little reminder sometimes of just the basic things. But I'm more excited about introducing you to some of my friends, I have asked several of my podcasting friends to share the interview that I did on their podcast, so that you can get to know not only you still get to hear from me about ADHD and whatever they're like podcast is focusing on but that I want you to be able to meet some other really great podcast host. Most of these are women, most of these are moms who are doing great things in the world. And I love what they're doing. I want to support them. And I want you to have really great podcasts in your feed that are they're supporting you and showing you who you can be and like bringing more light and wonderfulness and fun to your summer as you are doing your mom thing and trying to juggle all the things. So welcome to the best of series. And let's dive into today's episode. Today, I want you to meet my friend, Kelly, Kelly Donahue, you and I were in our coaching certification together. And while Kelly is not an ADHD coach, she is a coach for women who want to like ask for what you want have more fun she's super into like dismantling the patriarchy that has been internalized into your mind. Like you don't even realize that it's at work, because it's so much of a fabric of who we are. And this is something that a lot of ADHD people who have been socialized as women have is this internalized system that we don't even realize that we have all these rules about the way that we do things until somebody points them out. And then we're like, No, I don't think so. Don't tell me what I think and then realize oh, no, that's just what I think. So it has been an eye opening journey through my certification that I did with Kelly by my side and she invited me to be on her podcast, which is the badass moms podcast. If you feel like motherhood has been kinda like a raw deal. Kelly’s your girl. On her podcast, she talks to women who have found their fun and have let go of the impossible quote, selfless mothered standard that we were raised with. So if you're ready to ask for what you want, have more fun. Dismantle the internalized patriarchy Kelly show is for you. So here is the episode I did with Kelly. It's episode 105 on her podcast good moms play with their kids like this and why sticker charts or ADHD hill with yours truly, let's dive in.
Patricia Sung 04:48
Time is not a luxury moms get. We don't have like, oh, I scheduled four hours of uninterrupted block time every day for hard thinking. I'm like What old white dude wrote this that never cared for a toddler? Come on now. That's ridiculous. I am. I am, sir. I am happy that works for you. Can I hand you this three year old and let me know how that uninterrupted work time goes for you.
Kelly Donahue 05:20
I'm Kelly Donahue. And if you feel like motherhood has been kind of a raw deal, you're in the right place. You've achieved a ton in your life. But for years you've been giving until you have nothing left. Come listen to the women who've been in your shoes, who started asking for what they want, and saw the magic that happens when you break free from old expectations and lead the way in your own life. We share tools to create the powerful, vibrant fun you deserve, and confidently ask for what you want in all areas of life. Welcome to badass mom's. Friends. Welcome. I promised you experts and today we got experts the kind of expert that you need to hear from Patricia Sung is an adult ADHD coach and speaker helping moms with ADHD rise above the overwhelm, take control of your time and build a life you love in a way that works with your ADHD brain. She supports moms who have the ADHD or suspect they have it to understand ADHD and themselves. So you feel confident running your family and work life enjoy being a mom and lead your family. Well, after years of serial entrepreneurship teaching middle school, she has a uniquely practical perspective on strategies for building a life that works when your brain is different. If you're looking for more than theoretical textbook advice, Patricia teaches from a unique viewpoint from her years of effective application in the classroom as well as her own life. She has a top five parenting podcast motherhood and ADHD, which you must listen to I don't have ADHD and I still found it really calming and really centering. It's a lighthouse for mamas who have ADHD reminding us that we are never alone. In our struggles. Patricia, thank you so much for being here. Thank you for being new and sharing everything you've learned with moms around the world. It's, it's so important. Thank you.
Patricia Sung 07:26
I cannot wait, I'm so excited to dive in.
Kelly Donahue 07:30
Awesome. So I was combing through some of your most recent podcast episodes. And a thing that I hear a lot from moms is in terms of because badass moms is all about finding your fun and finding like being true to yourself creating that badass mom identity. And there's so much pressure to look back and say I'm not who I was, I don't even know if I like those things anymore. Can I do those things anymore? And you talk a lot about seasons, you gave this specific example of how you used to love cooking these, you painted the picture of these slow date nights with wine and slow cooking with your husband. How do you accept that that's changed? And how do you make your life fit? You know, and really going with those seasons? Who Whoo. I mean, it's hard.
Patricia Sung 08:22
I think a lot of times, when we're letting go those things that we wish we still had, there's a lot of sadness, and there's grief in there where, um, yeah, I wish dinner time was still date night, and, you know, being present and just the ease of it and that quality time and now. I still want presence. And they still want quality time. But it's not gonna be overcooking a pot of spaghetti. In this phase of my life. Right now. You know, my boys are five and eight. So right now like that's the struggle bus time of trying to get everything done. Make sure everybody's ready for the next day. Backpacks are ready. Did you eat your food, we eat our vitamins, you know, bathtime bed like, for a lot of moms, that's the stressful point in the day, and accepting that I am where I am. This is the season I'm in. What really matters to me in that moment, if presence is really important. And quality time is really important. Eating good nutrients for my body are important. How can I still make those three things happen? Given the situation that I'm in? Meals don't look like Ooh, let's try this recipe out of Food and Wine Magazine. There are way too many ingredients right now. Okay, like what's going to make sense for our family? Can I outsource some of this? Is there a way that I can pick up I order like, pre prep stuff that can fill in the holes. So I'm not making dinner every day. Can I find recipes that are still fairly like nutritional? And my kids will actually eat without 100 complaints. I mean, like, it's a whole nother ballgame. But I can still make those things happen. How am I going to make quality time happen with my husband, okay, it's not going to be between the hours of five and 7pm. We figured out like, we have like date nights during the week after the kids go to bed that are like, shorter, it's not going to be luxurious dinner, it's going to be, hey, can we play a game like we got this subscription for those like, they're like escape rooms, but they come in a box, they don't ever deliver to you. I got that him for him for Christmas. And so we have this escape room crate that we've been doing, and you play it in like three different parts. So over the course of the month, hopefully we can find three nights to hang out together and get our quality time. I still want to be present in that moment. So how do I change being present? When it's the chaotic part of the day, that means I need to take care of myself earlier in the day. So I have capacity come 5pm That means I'm trying to get food prepped earlier, so that I'm not starting at 4:53pm. I already know what's going to happen for dinner. And I have hopefully part of that prepped either like veggies chopped or something so that when my kids really want to talk to me. I'm not trying to read a 70 step recipe at the same time. So I can still do all those things that are that matter to me. But I have to figure out what what actually matters to me. And to what are the resources I have given the situation that I'm in right now. So that was a really long winded answer. But that that's where I am right now.
Kelly Donahue 12:05
And I think you touched on something that I find so key is parsing apart. what's actually important of my goals right now. And what can we say, I'm gonna put this off for later this may be isn't the season for this for slow meals as much as I enjoy it. Maybe this isn't the season for that and grieving that. But knowing that, you know, life is short, but life is long. And yeah, as you have said many episodes like one of our challenges, things are constantly changing, we're constantly having to adjust to things are different now than when the kids were three and five, you know, it's just very different. And finding that balance of what's important. Now in this season while still maintaining your uniqueness through all of it. You mentioned how to have capacity at 5pm. By taking care of yourself, I find that with a lot of the moms I talk to mornings and evenings are just a shit show. It's so hard not just for the kids, because everyone's hungry. You're just waking up and we've got like this list of things to do in the morning. But it can be very triggering for moms of having this overwhelm and this chaos and maybe you're still tired and all these things kind of add up. What have you found that helps you create capacity for yourself to be that present? Mom in the moment because that's what so many moms want is can I just be present for my kid when they turned to me want to show me this picture? Instead of saying, I'm reading this list or I'm too overwhelmed. How have you How do you feel that capacity tank
Patricia Sung 13:52
Oh, like this has been actually I think like my big project for the last like six months is learning how to draw boundaries that are good for me and good for my family but yet also allow me to do the work that I was called to do. Because I love my job. I love helping moms. I love talking about ADHD. I love talking about mental health. And that hyper focus in diving into what I love can easily bleed into everything else.
Patricia Sung 14:30
So my
Patricia Sung 14:33
big big learnings over the last probably six months that I've been working really hard on this and it's not been easy. And I'm not there yet I still have a ways to go.
Patricia Sung 14:44
Are one
Patricia Sung 14:47
figuring out the priorities of what really matters, I think for moms as a whole but especially for ADHD moms like when you look at like I want to be a good mom That goal is so lofty and overwhelming. And we feel like we have to do all the things in order to be a good mom. And that's not possible. So looking at, like, what does being a good mom look like for me? For some moms, it's going to be I want to be there when the kid walks off the bus. And for other moms, it's I want to be at every game they play. For other moms it's going to be, I want to rock them to sleep every night, like, what matters to you. Putting those things on the list, and knowing that, that means that probably the other 80% of things are gonna have to get dropped, we can't do them all. And that's a really hard lesson that I am still learning every day. And being okay with letting go of the things that I I can't do all the things. So how do I focus on what really matters. And that includes like, included in my business to have, I can't do all the things I have to limit so that I can keep my work within my work hours. Because otherwise it stresses me out at you know, I'm putting them to bed. And in the back of my mind. I'm thinking, Oh, I forgot to send that email, who I mean, I messaged you last night. I'm like, Oh, I forgot to send you my bio like, those things pop up. And when I know when that like that kind of stuff happening, I know that I'm at capacity and which I could tell you right now like there's a lot of stuff going on. In my I have two businesses and the other business is in a in a high season right now. And I know that I'm at capacity as a whole. So that means saying no to a lot of stuff. And drawing those boundary lines, letting go of a lot of things. I'm like you can't see me, but I got my number my fingers up here. And I think the fourth one would be what was the other one? Oh, I had such a good idea. And then just, I was like, this is the part of hmm, Ooh, good idea. It just left. It was, oh, it was taking care of myself during the day. So I have to schedule in my self care tasks. And I have to block that out. Or else I will go literally from the time I wake up till the time I put my head on the pillow. Because that's my personality, I'm a doer and a mover. And I know that if I don't slow down, I will do that all day long. And you can do that for a short amount of time. But you can't keep that up as a steady pace. So I have to schedule in like, this is your lunch break. Even though I have my own business, like I have to write in, like, you cannot schedule anything right here because this is your lunch break, I have to schedule in like, my like, I go, I go get a massage every month, and it is on the calendar every four weeks. And if it's not on the calendar, I am never gonna go ever. But if it's on the calendar, it's like, well, I already have it there. And she's expecting me I don't want to cancel on her last minute. Okay, I will, I will figure out how to make it work and go. And that, like it sounds like, Ooh, you get us massage every month. But it's like, if I don't stop and make myself literally, I You are required to lay on this table and not move for this time being I won't. So scheduling in those things. And it doesn't have to be something fancy like a massage. Sometimes it's like scheduling in your movement. Sometimes it's scheduling in like, I'm just gonna read my book for 20 minutes. Sometimes it's, I'm gonna go for a walk on my lunch break so that I can get in some fresh air in nature, like knowing what kind of planning you need to make those things happen. Because for some people like scheduling that in sounds terrible, I don't want to do it. Like I have a mom that is working with last week where she's trying to walk more. And she just knows like, there's going to be a point in my day, where I am tired of sitting at this desk and I need to move. So instead of just walking to the bathroom, she will go walk outside, even if it's five minutes. But she knows like her plan is the way she schedules that in is whenever I get antsy at my desk, I'm going to take a five minute walk around the parking lot and come back. So that that's how she gets her rest. And so like your scheduling doesn't have to look like my scheduling. It can be spur of the moment scheduling it can be I just feel antsy right now. I need to move, and this is the plan to do that. But knowing how are you going to take care of yourself during the day. How do you have capacity? Like mate capacity is like I look at like our stress level. It's like the higher it gets throughout the day. That's why we lose our ish on our kids come you know 522 And you're like, Hey, I just got off work. I've only been with them for 10 minutes. How am I yelling it Everybody, yeah, and then you're mad at yourself because to you it's been, quote, 10 minutes. Instead of, I've been going since 6am. And my boss was rude to me, and I got stuck in traffic, and this shirts really itchy. And I don't want to have to pay bills. And and and and at that point you don't have anything left. And that happens to be also when your kids walk in the door. So how do you create that space during the day, to lower your stress level so that you have space for it to go up, when inevitably our children are going to drive us bonkers at some point? How do you have the capacity to handle them? It's because you created it during the day in the way that makes sense for you.
Kelly Donahue 20:46
Mm hmm. And I think you hit two really important things that I want to call out. One is just noticing like, Are you a person who needs to schedule getting off the couch and doing something? Or are you a person who needs to schedule sitting down and journaling? And I tend to talk to more of the latter have just conditioned your whole life to be go go go, your brain leans in that direction. And even if you don't feel like you're achieving a lot, you're you are go go go all the time. Maybe you wouldn't even call yourself a high achiever, because you're like, oh, but I'm not as I haven't achieved as much as this person or I didn't reach this goal. Yeah. And it's so fun. I was just talking to choose nutritionist and health coach Megan Lyons. And she will wakes up at like five o'clock and has like, a seven item list of things she does before like her workday starts. That sounds like torture to me. But she's like, I don't it sounds terrible. But her it's funny because the things on her list are like, drink her tea, meditate journal go through, like her gratitude. thing for the day. I can't even list all the things she does. But to her that's her intentional slowdown, otherwise, she would sit in front of her computer and start answering emails, right. And that self knowledge of I need to work in slowness, or I need to work in productivity, and really letting that sink in to be like, am I just being an a hole to myself saying I need to be more productive? Or is there something deeper here? I do want to get back to that, because I think you have some really important points about doing that. But the second part, I'm really curious, because you, you mentioned like, you know, making time for what really matters to you. And you can't do the whole list. But you have to really do what matters to you. And I saw in my mind this like Venn diagram with three circles. And I want to pick your brain of where those overlap for you. One is what really matters to you. And I think there's a lot of contributing factors there of the shoulds. And what your picture of a good mom is. The next circle is what feels good to you. So for some people like pretend play, they effing hate it. Oh, can't stand even though they. But it like kind of matters to you to show up for your kid. But that does not fit into the diagram what feels good. And the third one is, what does your kid want you to do? And trying to find the road? And so are like So between those three cloths of what matters to me. How do I intersect that with intersect that with actually what actually feels good to me? How do I intersect that with something my kid is actually going to enjoy either short term or long term to Okay.
Patricia Sung 24:03
Take a sip of water I think for a second. Yes.
Kelly Donahue 24:08
And I think some of that is the shoulds the cultural and Kid desire shoulds like if your kid wants candy, you're not just gonna give them candy because that fits into their like what feels good to them. Yeah. And it doesn't fit into what matters to you. How do you listen to what Matt I think what's most important is what matters to you and what feels good to you and say you know what? Culturally, I don't care if this matters to other people. Because it doesn't feel good to me. I like yeah, maybe we use the pretend play example like what are the ways that instead of pretend play, you do something that you feel that cup was something that matters to you and feels good to you because turning towards your child does As matter if I can put that word in your mouth, yeah, it does matter.
Patricia Sung 25:03
So I like okay, so yeah, my, my little one little, both of them, they love per template, I cannot stand it, it drives me absolutely. up a wall. Like I just, it's really hard for me. And for a long time I was really I felt really ashamed about that. And, excuse me, I think I layered on a lot of shame of like, good moms play with their kids. But for some, like somehow good moms play with their kids, like this was attached there. And I didn't realize it. And so where I straddle that line is when my kids really want me to pretend play, I will. But I set a timer, and I let them know I will play whatever you want for 10 minutes. And then Mommy's going to do something else. And that way they get to do like whatever thing I cannot stand and they want me to do like I also cannot stand building Lego with them. They love and they're big into Lego right now. And it is like whenever they're together, then they just argue about like, I want to put this piece on. It's like not the actual Lego. It's the fact that they argue about who's going to do what next it and again, I'm like, this is very stressful to me. And I don't, I don't want to do this. Like this is a to like, example, this is a thing you do with your dad. I don't do Lego with them together, I'll do a one on one but not together. I'm not going to any like Chucky Cheese or Dave and Busters. Unless it's your birthday, I will wear my earplugs but like otherwise, that is a dad job. So number one I outsource number two, if it's something that I can handle for 10 minutes, like pretend play, I will set a timer for 10 minutes. And and I'm out. If I feel like I want to stick around, I can if it's like okay, this isn't feeling as torturous today as it normally does. You can stick around if you want. But I know that like I can handle anything for 10 minutes even. What if there was a way to put together your plan for the week so that you actually wanted to do the planning, you wanted to show up and figure it out? Because now your day is smoother, easier, calmer, it flows. You're not surprised by that field trip or that dentist's appointment, you know that that's coming? What have you had support to make the plan so you can actually follow through on it and feel good about yourself, this is the place to be to get your ish together, you are invited to successful mama meetups. It's a twist on productivity and community. It's time set aside to make your weekly plan followed by hanging out with other moms with ADHD who get you so you don't need to earn the fun, you're intertwining them in the same event. So you want to show up every week for just a few dollars a week, you'll have your plan set so that you can accomplish the tasks you need to get done. You know, when you're trying to work on your next business idea, do that fun craft with your kids, it's been sitting on the counter for months, you know the answer to the dreaded what's for dinner, you are present in the conversation with your kids after school or at dinner. Because you aren't a ball of stress. You can take care of you when you have a plan. When you have this you feel confident, capable, energetic, hopeful, relieved, like you can breathe. So sign up now at Patriciasung.com/meetup. And welcome to the successful mama community. We also have a Facebook group where you can connect with other moms because this isn't just about the time that we're together. This is about building your support system. So join us every week Sign up now at Patriciasung.com/meetup. And then three I look at okay, sure there's plenty of things that I don't want to do or that my kid doesn't find appealing. What what do we have in common? What are the things that we both enjoy doing? And how can we focus there so we love playing different kinds of like board games and puzzles and stuff. And that is really fun to my kids know that I will sit down and do a puzzle with them. Any time that's enjoyable to me even though it's the puzzle we've done 47 million times in the start to like lean towards that like the line here of enjoyable. Cool, that's now moved to the other category. Let's focus on now in this new phase of them growing. What is it that I love doing with them that they love doing with me and finding those commonalities? Because there's such a long list of things that aren't going to fit what one To our both people are going to want to do. How can I focus on what we both love doing?
Kelly Donahue 30:06
And lean in there? Yeah, I love that. Because it takes it does force you to take a beat to stop and think about it and be a little creative be like, Hmm, what do we both love doing? This isn't just like kid stuff versus me stuff like, where is this kind of new Venn diagram. And the two things I really took away from that is that, you know, people say, outsource, I think so much of the time we think of getting Fresh Direct, or getting a babysitter like no outsource was just Dad, this is no extra thing. This is me asking for help outsourcing some help from within our home, actually.
Patricia Sung 30:48
You can play that with your neighbor, friends, you can do that with your aunt and uncle like, it doesn't have to be a cost requirements. It just means that it's not me doing it.
Kelly Donahue 30:59
Yeah, I love that. And the second one was the 10 minute timer, 10 minutes for a kid feels long, like that is just so beautiful. And that will create a memory and they'll know mom did play with me. I want to get to something that you are really, really you're good at many things. But something that you really good at that stuck out to me was calling out this thing that I think a lot of us feel that consistency. And being consistent is a very triggering word. And I want would love to hear how you tackle that and why failure was your word of the year last year.
Patricia Sung 31:43
So I am a recovering perfectionist. It is very I'm also an Enneagram one if you're familiar with the Enneagram, which is the the perfectionist, I noticed like if there is a spelling error error, I will notice it like it is not something I look for my brain just finds the thing that does not belong. And I have spent a lot of time in the last few years working on that. And I purposely chose failure as the word of my year recently, because it made me do things that I knew I wasn't going to be good at. It made me pick things that like this is not gonna go well. And up until that point in my life I had become so afraid of, of messing up that I wasn't trying to do new things. I wasn't pushing myself out of my comfort zone. Because I didn't want to fail. Because I couldn't in that like place in my life. I couldn't handle the
Patricia Sung 32:52
like awful internal monologue that I had that went along with the failure and the shame that layered on to that. And between therapy and like, I don't know if you're familiar with David Bedrick. Who has worked with Simone Sol in the past, they did an unchanging clinic in the fall that I took so much from in really unraveling that. That inner monologue that like I just didn't realize how awful I spoke to myself for so many years. And like I won't get on my soapbox about how this is very common for especially women with ADHD but inattentive ADHD as well. So like straddling all genders, and when you are constantly told that your perception of reality of what the other person perceives as reality is incorrect. You create this self doubt and poor self monologue that's constantly telling you to like, what did you mess up? Did you miss something? Were you being careless? Were you being lazy? What did you do wrong? And so I just never realized all this time how negative I spoke to myself. So in this process of failing, I had to mess up. I had to try things that weren't necessarily guaranteed. So that I could like, create a new pattern in myself to be okay with things not going well. And that I was still okay. I was still safe. I survived. My ego may be bruised, but I made it. So that's how I ended up with failure as my word of the year. And when they come in, like two or three years ago, I think now, and I would do it again in a heartbeat. It totally sad I won't lie. Like, um, but I have so much more tolerance now for the failure and now I don't remember what the first part of that question is. So you're going to have to remind me why first part,
Patricia Sung 34:56
consistent as a trigger word, so go along with that. I'm sorry, I'm just sip of water because I'm when I get excited, I
Patricia Sung 35:09
talk a lot faster,
Kelly Donahue 35:10
I'm glad you're excited.
Patricia Sung 35:12
Um, my, my tongue dries off faster because I'm moving so fast, okay. And when we've been told that the key is consistency, a lot of people with ADHD, and like anxiety, depression, a lot of mental health issues, what we do is when we're striving for consistency, we're actually striving for perfection, we're expecting ourselves to not mess up ever. And we don't look like if you have a sticker chart, and you're marking like all the great things you did, we don't look at how many stickers we have, we look at how many stickers we don't have. And what we should have done to get that sticker and how we messed up and we made a bad choice and look at you what's wrong with you? Why don't you have all your stickers, you could have gotten that sticker over here, if you had just done this. And we go on this whole like, again, that negative, like mental narrator that tells us that we're not good enough. And when you have ADHD, it's already hard to build habits, it takes us longer to build habits than regular people, like there's already that like, nonsense about it taking 21 days to build a habit, not true. It's actually much longer for that for all humans, let alone if you have ADHD. So if you already have something that's going to create more difficulty in the situation for you. And then you're holding yourself to the standard that is literally impossible, it is impossible to be perfect.
Patricia Sung 36:34
All you're going to do is end up
Patricia Sung 36:37
talking poorly to yourself and bring yourself down and then your energy is going towards the negative instead of the positive and how you can move forward. So when I am working with moms, I always say our goal is not perfection, our goal is not to do this every day. Generally speaking, the goal is more often than not. So if you think about like, you know, the average, if there's seven days in the week, hopefully we can get to four. But if we didn't like you, if you still did two days a week, that's better than nothing. I don't care what the habit is, if you did it two times, that's better than zero. And our goal is to do it more often than we don't. So we just keep pushing forward. And when you are somebody who's overcome a lot, whether that's with ADHD, or trauma or anxiety, or depression, or like whatever your you know, struggle is we often have developed a really great ability for persistence. And so I will shout with my megaphone all day long that persistence matters more than consistency and the fact that you are trying to make it happen. Because I think that's a lot of where it where it becomes harmful is that people are trying and it's not working out. And then they think something's wrong with them because it didn't work out. And it's like, well, maybe we were trying to do something that didn't make sense. Maybe we were trying to do it in a way that didn't fit you. So how can we be persistent? How can we keep going when things are hard. And like caveat here, a lot of people with ADHD or mental health struggles, will continue to persist because they're good at it, and things that they should let go. And I don't say the word should very often but like, you know, like, if you're in a bad relationship, or you're trying to achieve some goal, that's not worth it like you keep going, because you're really good at keeping going. Like, it's also okay to let those go when they aren't serving. What's best for you. So sidenote, there's that. But we're really good at persisting and keep trying.
Patricia Sung 38:47
And that, like,
Patricia Sung 38:52
a lot of times we beat ourselves up for like not having enough internal motivation. And there's so many times I'm like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, look at all the things you've overcome. Look at all the ways that you've persisted, look at all the ways that you kept going when people didn't believe in you, or people told you, you couldn't do it. And you still tried to make this thing work. You have the gift of persistence. And what I love about persistence is that it gives us the freedom to look for ways that we could do this in a different way. Because consistency really has that undertone of like, same, same, same, same same, and that there's some expectation we have to uphold, whereas persistence allows us to be like, hey, ooh, you know, I really want to drink more water. This isn't coming together. What can I do differently? Can I ask an accountability buddy? Like, can I you know, do I have a friend I can just text every day at 2pm You can schedule that text you don't have to remember and say like, Hey, how's your water intake and then they'll respond back to you. Hey, how's your water and taking the like, oh, look a texture ma'am. Yes, take some ice drink some water. Like, when then you have this like problem solving, creativity ability that you can put into play because your goal is to be persistent and try something new and figure it out in a way that makes sense for you. Because, for me, like if I think about my water intake, it's like, on the days where I'm at my desk, and I'm working, I work three days a week, I'm a fabulous water drinker on those three days, because I put my cup on my desk. I'm talking a lot. So I'm constantly drinking, and it works out. And then on Monday, when I'm not working, and I'm running around the house, I'll get to like lunchtime, and I'm like, Ooh, I don't think I drink water. Since I brush my tea this morning. Did I brush my teeth this morning? Like, any you go down this like, Oh, man. So like, kids, like, if you look at my consistency, it's terrible. There's two, two to four days a week. I'm terrible drinking water in three days that I am. And then I look very inconsistent. But like, persistence wise, okay, look, I got three days sorted out, I got a plan here that's working for me. What can I do on the four days that it's not working for me to drink more water. And when we look at it with this grace for ourselves, to try something different, that drops our stress level way down. And then we actually have the capacity for our like, cerebral cortex to like, come online and be like, hey, oh, look, our problem solving is available to us now, because we're not super stressed. And we can, we actually have the physical ability to come up with other solutions. When we're super stressed, we don't our brain has shut down. Our brain is in survival mode. There are no extra resources for creative problem solving, hear people we are just trying to live. And when we take that moment, and start to literally like, we have to train ourselves to give ourselves grace and space and time to think about things and allow ourselves to look for those solutions. Like
Patricia Sung 42:08
that is hard work.
Patricia Sung 42:09
Especially as a mom when you don't have like the time is not a luxury moms get.
Patricia Sung 42:15
We don't have like, oh, I scheduled
Patricia Sung 42:18
four hours of uninterrupted block time every day for hard thinking. And like, what old white dude wrote this that never cared for a toddler? Come on out. Like that's ridiculous. I am. I am. Sir. I am happy that works for you. Can I hand you this three year old and let me know how that uninterrupted work time goes for you? Hmm. So your advice? Not for me? Thank you put that aside. And what's going to work for me? How can I give myself grace in the crevices of mom life, to look at those places where it's like, how can I problem solve this in a time where I am not super stressed, which is rare as moms and allow ourselves the space to like find those patterns. Because when we have that space, and without the stress, it's like, oh, it's really easy to see five different options of how I could solve this problem. But in the moment, we don't have that capacity. So it's like this catch 22 of taking care of ourselves enough that we have capacity to do what we need to do so that we have the space to do the other thing. It's like, it's like a, it's a vicious cycle that we have the ability to shift the tide on, is it can keep getting worse. Or it can slowly get better.
Patricia Sung 43:49
And it is like
Patricia Sung 43:51
props off to like all moms who are in this generation of doing the hard work to take care of ourselves and shifting the way that we look at motherhood is that this is hard work. But we're making this shift for generations. Yeah.
Kelly Donahue 44:10
I'll let you know I have like 28 marked clips of like just mic drop moments.
Patricia Sung 44:19
Watch out you let me talk to you long you're gonna be like Oh, it's
Kelly Donahue 44:21
just so good. And this is like this is the intersection of badass moms and motherhood ADHD, of why is asking for what I want important. Why is my font important is because it fills that cup of capacity in allows your brain to actually like turn back on to say, How can I problem solve? How can I show up in my favorite way? And you can't do that. If we're stressed all the time, literally not able to access that part of our brain. So I just love I've been like nodding emphatically like handing the AR this whole time like, yes, yes. And so to wrap up I have kind of three points you can pick or choose Combine them in what makes you feel like a badass right now Patricia? And how can someone make life feel? More you not how can they make life feel more Patricia but right? What are like probably both like, existentially but also like you have tools for people so that a mom listening can make life feel more her not the shoulds not the pressure, not the aihole voice in her head. So those are my two wrap questions. What makes you feel like a badass right now? And how can moms get help to make life feel? More like you?
Patricia Sung 46:09
So recently, I went paddleboarding for the first time. And it wasn't just the fact that like I managed to paddleboard without falling off because I was just waiting for the moment is going to happen. And I had one or both of my kids on the front which does not make for stable, stable paddling but I have been extremely sick over the last three years and to the point where I was almost dead and I like was bedridden in the fact that I was able to do an activity like paddleboarding that is so physical. And to see that like I am turning the corner to like almost being back to normal like not quite, but I'm close. The whole spring Drake break. The whole spring break trip was just a huge celebration of like, I am a badass, I have worked my butt off to be healthy. And get my body out of that stress response that had sunk so far deep into that like I didn't even see. I had no joy. I had zero joy, no joy left. Because I was so stressed and my body was literally falling apart. And to get to that moment where I was like, I am effing paddleboarding. Y'all paddleboarding, like, to me, like I mean, granted, not like an extreme sport, but like, very physical, the fact that I had the capability to do that was just amazing. It was literally an entire week of celebrating of like, I can swim, I could snorkel I like did all the things in that moment of knowing like, it's, it's awful as this last three years have been and how hard I have worked, it is worth it. And I'm like, mentally, I'm like, I'm there, I can do this physically, like, I know, my body's not far behind. So, that is the most recent time I felt like a badass and then to be more you
Patricia Sung 48:13
is learning that you are good enough just like you are, you are not broken. And you were created to be the way that you are. Full stop. Not so that you can change not that so you can be more consistent not so that you can do whatever you like you were created the way you are and you are loved just like that you are good enough, you are not broken. And as you go through that journey of accepting yourself and learning how to love yourself and learning how to unravel all the negative stuff that's been layered in your life, which some of us have more than others. And some of us have started at points that were way more difficult than other people like except me like who you may have a lot to untangle. And you may have more than others have to untangle. And it is worth every therapy session. Every time you forgive yourself every time you do the work and whatever it is that you're doing to take care of yourself and subsequently that means you're taking care of your family it is well worth it. And then as you learn to be more and more okay with who you are on that long journey. That is how you will learn how to make things more you because you will begin to like find who you are under all those layers of trauma to actually find the person that If you truly are, minus what everyone else is expected of you and what everyone else is put on you. When you find that, that's how you can start to make your life more you is by actually finding out like who the you is underneath all that little bit of an existential answer but
Kelly Donahue 50:24
I mean, I've had tears like this, this whole answer. It's just I I'm just so grateful for you exist to anyone listening, it
Kelly Donahue 50:33
is very clear why you have a top five parenting podcast like thank you for sharing your voice with us. Here today. It's it's such a gift.
Patricia Sung 50:45
Thank you. Well, thank you for having me. I always welcome the opportunity to pump up moms and we matter we are the leaders of our families, what you're doing matters and very much needed. And where can people find you right now, Patricia. So I am to keep it really simple for ADHD brains. I am motherhood and ADHD everywhere. So website handles, whatever you need find it is motherhood and ADHD. And if you are struggling with anything ADHD related, and you go to my website, I have a ton of free resources there. I have one that's called the toolkit and it's all my free resources in one spot. So you can download everything from like, if you want a checklist of symptoms to try to figure out do you have ADHD from like techniques to calm down when you're like I'm gonna punch everyone in my family in the face because I'm so mad right now. Like, all this is are in one spot and it's at my website, Patricia sung.com. Forward slash toolkit, all one word, or just go back to the podcast name and Google that and you'll find me too. So
KELLY DONAHE 51:54
amazing. Thank you so much for Patricia I really appreciate it.
Patricia Sung 51:57
Thanks so much for having me, Kelly.
Kelly Donahue 52:01
Thanks so much for listening. Go to the show notes for links to anything cool mentioned in this episode, and head to Instagram to follow all the badass moms adventures over at Cal Bell badass moms. That's ke l ve l underscore badass moms. Like what you heard, rate and review the podcast wherever you listen, I would be so grateful. I'll see you soon. You got this
Patricia Sung 52:31
for more resources, classes and community head over to my website motherhood in adhd.com