Balancing Work, Family, and ADHD with Crystal Ware #228
How do you juggle growing professionally while also being a great mom and taking care of yourself?
Meet today’s guest, Crystal Ware. Crystal and I dive into a dual episode that is being aired both on my podcast and on her podcast “Get Clear with Crystal Ware”.
From discussing the struggles of balancing work and family, to offering advice on advocating for a raise at work, Crystal's insights provide valuable guidance for women in professional settings.
Together, we’re exploring the complexities of managing ADHD in both mothers and their children, shedding light on medication, emotional regulation, and the importance of self-care.
Crystal Ware is on a mission to empower women to pursue their dreams with confidence, authenticity and purpose. She left a successful (yet stressful) career as a Fortune 500 leader and attorney on her quest to find more time, money and freedom, trading in the title of “attorney” for a new role as “entrepreneur and coach”.
Now, she helps other women define their own path to success, wealth, health, so they, too, can have the joy, faith, and freedom that she created for herself! Crystal believes everyone can build their dream and find true satisfaction and fulfillment, they just need to get clear on their dreams, build the courage, and find a little inspiration.
That's why she launched the Get Clear with Crystal Ware Podcast (with more than 100 inspiring episodes to tune in for), and recently launched her new website, The Well Defined Woman. You are made for more, so join her in creating it for yourself.
links mentioned in this episode
Crystal is currently reading The Alchemist, by Paulo Coehlo.
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Crystal Ware 00:00
Most successful people in the world have heard no a million times and kept going. That's how they got there. They didn't get there because they took the path of least resistance. They didn't get there by having everybody just love them and follow over them. They got there through a lot of closed doors that they just kept knocking on.
Patricia Sung 00:20
Are you overwhelmed by motherhood and barely keeping your head above water? Are you confused and frustrated by how all the other moms make it look so easy, you can figure out how to manage the chaos in your mind, your home, or your family, I get your mama, parenting with ADHD is hard. Here is your permission slip to let go of the Pinterest worthy visions of organization and structure fit for everyone else. Let's do life like our brains do life creatively, lovingly, and with all our might. When we embrace who we are and how our brains work, we can figure out how to live our lives successfully, and in turn, lead our families well, at the end of the day, we just want to be good moms. but spoiler alert, you are already a great mom.
Patricia Sung 01:11
ADHD does not mean you're doomed to be a hot mess mama. You can rewrite your story from shame spiral to success story. And I'll be right here beside you to cheer you on. Welcome to Motherhood in ADHD. Hey there successful mama, it's your friend Patricia Sung. Today on the podcast we have my friend Crystal. Now Crystal and I have known each other for quite a few years, our kids went to preschool together. And I have watched her just blossom from corporate go getter. She's an attorney into creating her own business and really lifting women up.
Patricia Sung 01:47
I think that is one of her greatest gifts of encouragement and seeing where women need to hear the good stuff and lift them up and connect and see the beautiful gifts that you have, that you can build this beautiful life and you deserve it so much. So Crystal is on a mission to empower women to pursue their dreams with confidence, authority and purpose. She left her successful and very stressful career at a fortune 500 company as an attorney both as a leader and as an attorney to find more time, money and freedom and trade in the life of stress for her new role as entrepreneur and coach that she can be more present with her family.
Patricia Sung 02:30
She helps other women define their own path to success, wealth and health so that you too can have the joy, Faith and Freedom that she's created for herself. She believes that everyone can build the dream and find true satisfaction and fulfillment. They just need to get clear on their dreams, build the courage and find a little inspiration and that is why she launched the Get clear with Crystal Ware podcast. There's over 100 episodes for you to go nosh on and as she recently launched a new website called the Well Defined Woman, which you can find at thewelldefinedwoman.com. Because you are made for more so join her in creating that for yourself over there on her new website.
Patricia Sung 03:10
Today Crystal and I jump into it was a really great conversation about going back to the basics. And she has some really great questions about how we support our kids. Then I asked her about how do we have those tough conversations with a boss or somebody in power? When we feel like either we are being a people pleaser, and we're not speaking up for ourselves or we feel like we're bulldozing through and people aren't taking us seriously or they're misconstruing what we mean? How do we work on our communication skills to be able to have those tough conversations, and also the balancing of many roles in our lives, whether that's being a mom, a partner, working, having your own company, how do we balance those things when when life gets busy, and a quick reminder that today's the last day to grab your early bird tickets.
Patricia Sung 03:54
So if you haven't done that already, go to patriciasung.com/retreat, grab your ticket for the retreat that's coming up in the fall and I cannot wait to see you in person. So I'm so excited for you to meet my friend Crystal Ware. We are doing a dual episode here. So we are attempting to meld together two styles and make it into one podcast. And so I'm like welcome Crystal but also welcome me.
Crystal Ware 04:20
Welcome Patricia. Yes. Which is exciting, right? Because everybody's busy your audiences, largely either working moms, busy moms, whatever. Moms ladies are busy, we have so many things that we have to do. So we are not any different. Right? Patricia, we have the same challenges and so trying to make the best use of our time and get our audiences all this amazing information.
Patricia Sung 04:44
So we're gonna attempt to fold the two together and do a double episode where it'll be on both of our podcasts. So as you listen to this on whichever one you started at, you can cross over and check out the other podcast and see what great things lie in past episodes. So if you can do like the one sentence introduction, because like I already did an intro, they already heard all your good stuff, like, in one sentence, what do you do?
Crystal Ware 05:08
I help women achieve whatever their dream life is. So, you know, that really looks like something different for everybody. And my goal is to help them believe that it's attainable, because I believe it is. And now I want all of you to believe it is to. And so that's what it's about just bringing insights and based rooted in wealth and health, you can't have one without the other. And what about you? I know all about you. We have known each other for several years, actually, everybody. So I know all about Patricia. But how do you summarize what you do for people?
Patricia Sung 05:41
So I'm an ADHD coach for moms. So there's a lot of resources out there for parenting kids, I actually help mom. So when Mom is struggling with ADHD, how do we get your life together so that you can actually enjoy it? Which is why I felt like we were a really great pairing because I want moms to know that they can live well with ADHD, it doesn't have to be this like awful cloud that hangs over your head all the time. Like, is it hard? Yes, it is. But we don't have to live in suffering and burnout and overwhelm. You can figure out the ways that work for you to be able to be really successful. And I don't want to say like in spite of ADHD, it's like with your ADHD to be really successful with your ADHD.
Crystal Ware 06:21
Yeah, and I really love that Patricia, because I think it crosses over for even women that may be undiagnosed, or they don't maybe truly have ADHD. But the world that we're living in now is so busy and chaotic and crazy. We're inundated with information and activities and schedules that like I think the average mom has some of those feelings and challenges to regardless of whether they have ADHD. So I think these are going to be tools and resources that can be useful for everybody.
Patricia Sung 06:52
Yeah. And when we talk about, like, the things that really work for ADHD, a lot of those tenants still follow for everyone. One of my favorite questions is like, how do you make this easier for yourself? That question works for everybody. There's always ways to make something easier for yourself. And a lot of times we've just done it that way forever, or because our mom did it that way, or because our boss told us to do it that way.
Patricia Sung 07:12
And when we critically thinking, look at it and say like, how do we make this easier for me? Anybody can use those kinds of strategies to make life better, because we don't have to suffer as this moms. We have too much to do. There's too much going on. We're trying to help all the people. We don't need to do it from a place of pain, suffering martyrdom?
Crystal Ware 07:32
Absolutely not. I couldn't agree more. The other thing I wanted to make sure in case people were questioning is I know you primarily work with moms that have some form of ADHD or other issues in that realm. But you also help moms with kids that have ADHD that may be struggling,
Patricia Sung 07:50
Yes, because most of the time, if you have ADHD, there's a pretty good chance you your kids do too. So if you have ADHD, the chance that your kids have it is 50 to 70%, which is way more than the average. They think it's somewhere like five I think it's closer to 10% of people who have it. So if you have it your kid probably don't do got it?
Crystal Ware 08:11
Well, I think that's really helpful. Because I know, it seems like pretty prevalent, especially amongst little boys in elementary school. And that can be challenging. Also, just how do you handle a child that may be struggling? And how that wears on people? So yeah, I'm excited to dive in and talk about all these amazing things with you.
Patricia Sung 08:29
Me too. And I think it's so hard as a mom, because you always want your kid to do well. And when your kid is struggling and you don't know why. And you can't figure out the solutions, it pretty much takes over your focus. And all of a sudden, everything else falls to the backburner and you're like I gotta help my kid. So to me like the to go hand in hand is that I'm here to help mom, but like very aware that when your kids struggling, all of a sudden, that's moved up to first place on the priority list. So
Crystal Ware 08:54
yeah, well, I think they go hand in hand because it's like, as a mom, what are the solutions? How do you parent, a child that is struggling? Or you know, has different emotional needs? And like, what are those tools and resources and those aren't? You know, it's not like we have training books that we come up with, you know, everybody's different. Yes,
Patricia Sung 09:16
yes. So I guess let's go ahead. Like I'll just jump in there of like, when your kid is struggling, like what do you look for? And specifically, like when it comes to ADHD, there's so many different ways that it shows up for people. So like, the way it's going to show up in one person's gonna be totally different than how it shows up in another person. There's a lot of themes, but there's not like some like one telltale sign of like, if you just have this one thing, you know, it's like no, it's a complex neurodevelopmental disorder.
Patricia Sung 09:46
And it shows up differently for everyone. So like, we all know the classic little kid who's bouncing off the walls doesn't pay attention isn't you know, driving everyone bonkers around them and then we're no we're like, oh, that kid obviously has ADHD. But where we don't often notice It is in the more inattentive side. So the students who are doodling or daydreaming, and especially, you'll see this tends to be more women but not necessarily like it's not to say that there aren't little boys who also fall in the inattentive category, which means those little boys also grow up to be adults. So this is like across the board. People who are more on the inattentive side of ADHD are the doodlers the dreamers.
Patricia Sung 10:24
But there's also the side of like the chatty Cathy's, the perfectionist, the overachievers, ADHD doesn't side with certain traits. It's not only for people who are rich, or poor, or smart, or not that smart, like there's no, no group of people who are saved for ADHD. So it's like, if you're a smart person, you figure out the coping mechanisms that work for you. And you figure out how to make it work you get by, and usually where we see it pop up is when there's been either some kind of hormonal change. So we see it in like, when girls get their periods when you become a mom, so much lessons when you're going through menopause, for boys and puberty.
Patricia Sung 11:05
So you see it in these hormonal changes, but also when you have a large life change. So it can be things like when you have a baby, all of a sudden, your life is very different, or you move from high school to college, because in high school, things are very prescribed for you. There's a lot of instruction, first period, second period, third period, you go to college, and it's like, did you show up for 9am class, no one's gonna check like there's a huge shift in like, the structure and how your life is running in a new job. A lot of times we'll see it like elementary to middle or middle to high school, a lot of times, it'll show up around like third grade, that's when reading starts to get hard for kids, because that's when we move from books that have like, you know, one or two lines on a page, there's some pictures to give you clues. And all of a sudden, you're now in chapter books that are full page of text and not a lot of pictures. So these are the times where we'll see it pop up more. That's not to say that you wouldn't notice it at other times.
Patricia Sung 11:53
But that's where we start to see like all of a sudden, either I'm struggling or my kid is struggling in these patterns are usually when it pops up for people. So it's not just the people who can't sit still. It's the ones who are over thinkers, it's the ones who have intrusive thoughts. It's the ones who are anxious, the ones that are struggling with depression, like there's just so much more to it than just hey, I can't pay attention in class.
Crystal Ware 12:18
Absolutely. Absolutely. Well, I wanted to dive in to one question that I think is the hard to answer question. But specifically with kids, I know you have resources for moms that want to you know, get their life together, get more organized, have an easier way and don't necessarily want medication, what is your feeling about medication for kids.
Patricia Sung 12:42
So generally speaking, they recommend that you don't start medication until after five. So when they're when kids are younger than five, they generally won't recommend medication, the way I look at medication is that, first of all, it's one tool, it's only one tool, you have to have all the other pieces in place to make the most difference. So even if we sort out the medicine, there's still a lot of other skills that we need to have. Like there's a saying pills don't give skills like just because you have the medicine that works for you doesn't mean that you then know how to like organize a research paper, or you know how to clean your bedroom, the pills don't give you skills, what it does is it creates an environment where it is now easier and not easier for everyone else easier for you, hopefully leveling the playing field.
Patricia Sung 12:42
So something that was really difficult for you before is now easier so that it's not quite as difficult as it was, but it's not going to be as easy for somebody who doesn't have ADHD. So we're just evening the playing field admits was just one tool. But given that, like, it's an extremely helpful tool, and my like blanket advice, and it's different for everyone. And I can't say like your family might be very anti medicine and be like, well, this is take this with a grain of salt is that medicine is a really, really helpful tool. And most people don't go find this very helpful tool until the doodoo has hit the fan. And now you're trying to fix everything else that's on fire and find the right medicine. And that's a lot to handle at the same time.
Patricia Sung 14:10
So if you have the option to do it earlier, I would say try the medicine, figure out what works for you. And if you decide it's not for you, cool, but you've got it in your back pocket to know this medicine works. For me, this dose works for me or this medicine works for my kid, this dose works for my kid, I understand how the insurance works. And you have that tool sitting there. And if you feel like it's not needed at that time, great, but you haven't there. The problem is it's a really long process to get the diagnosis, find the right doctor, get all the insurance stuff worked out.
Patricia Sung 14:41
Like by the time you go through all that and you start even testing different medicines. It's been several months while things have been on fire and you're trying to help your kid. It's a lot on your patients. It's really frustrating. It's hard. So knowing that if there's a way you could start that process earlier and get your kid the tool they need even if you're not using it right now. That's fine, you have it there. Because the thing is like if you realize your kid has ADHD in second grade, and they're doing all right, like, it's not great, but we've heard I was working lovely. But the problem is when they go from fifth grade to sixth grade, and then the doodoo hits the fan, you're starting from ground zero, whereas if you already know, my kid does better in the Adderall family versus the Ritalin family or I know they do better with this extended release, or they do better with this brand.
Patricia Sung 15:23
Like because unfortunately, they're all different, which is really annoying. Like, it's a lot of trial and error to find the right one. So then when your kid goes to sixth grade, and they're struggling, you can be like, cool, we already have a base knowledge, and it's gonna be a lot easier for us to find the right medicine that they're going to need now, which will be different as they grow. They might need like a higher dose or something, and they may not. Sidenote, like ADHD medicine is not based on like your age, it's not based on weight, like you give your kids Tylenol a certain amount for they're like, wait, no, that's not how it works.
Patricia Sung 15:49
So some people need a little bit, some people need a whole lot, it has nothing to do on their size, age, anything like that. So it's like, if you have that base level of knowing it's so much easier to figure it out, when they really need it. That's the hard part of like, when people start trying, they're like, Oh, my kids failing seventh grade. And they don't have any friends. And and, and, and and then like, and now we're trying to test medicines. I'm like, Whoa, buckle I
Crystal Ware 16:12
got a lot going on.
Patricia Sung 16:14
We want to figure that out. But like, the medicines take time to sort out. It's unfortunately, they have tests that they're running on trying to figure out like if there's a way to know, but unfortunately, those tests aren't super accurate. So for some people, they give great information. And for some people they don't. So it's like, yeah, I hope they figured out that technology, that would be lovely. If they had that. That was like more like surefire. But like, it's hard. And like even now with all the medication shortages, like, I know what medicine works for me now I can't find it. Well, now I have to call the pharmacy and see what they have in stock and be like, does that one work for me? I don't know. It's like playing craps. Like, let's roll the dice and see what happens. It's this like rigmarole of a dance every time I go to get my medicine every month. And you know, I'll find one that works.
Patricia Sung 16:56
I'm like, Cool. And they're like, oh, it's out of stock. And they try another one. I'm like, well, that one didn't really work. They had a like a kind of a crash at the end of the day. So let me try this one. It's just, that's really hard. So if you can sort that out, when it's not dire, it's so much easier than trying to do it in there. So more of the story. I think everyone should try it know if it works for you. Because some people it doesn't help. It's a small percentage, but it something like 15% of people don't have any assistance by medication. But like know, if it helps have some background of understanding what works for you, is that when you need it, it's there
Crystal Ware 17:26
Yeah, I think that's helpful for people to know, because it's obviously a struggle for you as an adult to consider Should I take a medication? Should I try something, then obviously, you layer that on to wanting to make the best decisions for your children and that it's, you know, it can be very stressful for people. So what do you see is the biggest stressor or the biggest conflict with moms that have ADHD and also are struggling with a child with ADHD?
Patricia Sung 17:52
Is that when you are trying to assist somebody who also has a spicy brain, and you have a spicy brain, I
Crystal Ware 17:59
love spicy brain. I like a great way to describe it. My
Patricia Sung 18:03
friend Mary van Geffen, she's a hoot, you should go look her up. She calls them the spicy ones. Yeah, she I think she trademarked it. It's a it's her phrase. When you have a spicy brain, and you're trying to also wrangle more straight, spicy brains, like it's hard to wrangle one spicy brain. But when you have one spicy brain trying to wrangle another spicy, it's a bit of a circus. And when we're trying to teach our kids things that we don't really do well ourselves. It's really frustrating. Because a lot of times when you go to the doctor and you get your kid diagnosing, like, here's what your kid needs, and they list out all these things that you're like, I don't do those for me. I don't know how to do those things.
Patricia Sung 18:37
But you want me to do them for somebody else. Like what? So like, that's why I teach moms the skills that I do, because we're the ones expected to be able to teach our kids the things that we ourselves are struggling. I mean, Apple didn't fall far from the tree. And so we have to be centered and grounded and know what works for us and have that toolkit built for ourselves, for us to be able to do that for somebody else.
Patricia Sung 19:01
Yeah. And a lot of times is moms will be like, No, I'll be fine. Let me just figure this out for my kid. And it's like, I understand that as a mom, I know you're like, but my kids more important. I got to help them first. But it's like the whole oxygen mask. Like when you're on the airplane. They're always like, especially I fly southwest, the flight attendant literally always comes over and she's like, you have to put your mask on first. And she makes you give the like head nod. Like, if you can't function. You can't teach someone else to function. It's literally not possible.
Patricia Sung 19:26
And somehow we think as moms, we're like it's cool. I'm juggling all the things. Sure I'll figure it out like when you take care of you that ripple out effect makes it so much better for your kids. So it can just be I'm going to do everything for my kid and I'll figure myself out later. It's so much like It's like swimming upstream.
Crystal Ware 19:43
Well that makes me think of I've taken to writing my husband always does morning drop off and I've taken in the last few months to going with them and so we listen to music The kids love to jam and there's this new song if you guys haven't listened to it called Sunday best buy surfaces which I thought was a silly name for a band. But apparently, the Gen Z folks love that name the surfaces anyway, part of its like, always blessed, never stressed. And I was like guys is this what mom needs to take in a little more like, I am blessed. Now I need to not be stressed. I'm running around like a crazy person that's just like my personality. And that is what kids teach you is like, it is a mirror to you of like, okay, you want them to be relaxed, you want them to be calm. I'm not a calm person, that's just not my personality.
Crystal Ware 20:32
And I've definitely noticed it and try to tell myself like, not stressed. And so now we listen to the song all the time. And I'm like, Oh, this is a good reminder for me to start the day, like, take a deep breath, not gonna get all wound up. And if you want the kids to be, you know, more Zen, you have to be more Zen, they are going to learn from what you're doing. That's the biggest shift that I've looked at making for myself is like, you know, and what's even crazier is my parents weren't stressed, my parents weren't running around, like, Oh, we're in a hurry. Where did it in fact, even now, and my parents are, they're like, why are you in such a hurry, Crystal? And I'm like, I don't know, why am I? Why is it like a big deal? Like, we gotta get everywhere fast. And so I think that's good advice. I mean, it's just such a good analogy to say we have to put our oxygen mask on first, and that they're going to learn what we teach them. Yeah, I think it's important
Patricia Sung 21:22
to know like, if your personality is big energy, go get them like, we're not trying to squash that what we're trying to do is make that feel easier for you like you can be big energy and not stressed, right, you can go hard and not be stressed about it. And a lot of times, we just smoosh all those things together in to one category. And you you don't have to like because I am a very like Type A I'm an Enneagram. One. Like I like things to be the way I want them to be. And like I'm not trying to change who I am.
Patricia Sung 21:55
But I don't want my stress level to be embedded into my children. So how do I make sure that I teach them excellence and also like, but we don't have to be running around like a chicken with their head cut off? Yeah, and screeching at everybody. Like, it's a hard balance to learn. And as moms when we're not taking care of ourselves, that stress level just is constantly butting up against everything, because there's always another permission slip to fill out. There's always another thing after school, there's always another like naptime looming. Like if I don't get this kid to bed, then we know it's going to ruin the afternoon. Like there's always something else coming as moms. So it's on us to drive the environment.
Patricia Sung 22:36
Like that's really like why I came back to working with moms after teaching. Like I always thought I would go back to the classroom after my kids were older. And I now know from teaching, it's like, I mean, I have your kid for 45 minutes, or if they're an elementary school all day, like in the school hours, but like, they're still home with you more than they're with me. So when mom is in a good place, the entire family can be in a good place. But when mom's not well, the whole family is struggling. And it's obvious.
Crystal Ware 23:05
Well, I wanted to go back to something you said because I wonder if this is something you've talked about before, or something that other people have had difficulty with. But you said you're an Enneagram one you like things how you like them, you like things orderly did you struggle with as the kids got older? You know, obviously, they have their own personality, they have their own way? Did you struggle with just the house in general of like, no, no, we don't do it this way. No, no, we don't put that there of like having not just a husband, but now you have multiple children, and you can't control the whole house was at a struggle for you,
Patricia Sung 23:38
for sure. And it's often that I have to ask myself, like, Does this really matter? Yes. am I teaching my kids how to do this well, in a way that works for them? Or am I trying to smash like my opinion on them of how this should go? Because I have my two boys one is definitely more like me. He looks just like my husband, but his personality is me. And my other one is so like, happy go lucky. Everything's great. Like, he's the one who like as soon as he sees that you're a little bit sad. He's the one who runs up and it's like, I love you so much. You're the best mommy there ever was like, he's ready to like, cheer you up. And he's not in order.
Patricia Sung 24:16
Yeah, he's like the cheerleader of the family. And I constantly have to tell myself, like, what works for me is not going to work for him because that's not his priority. His priority is not that everything needs to be orderly. So when I start getting over the top, I remind myself to like, look at my kids and in their eyes, and like really be present the moment like patrician testis really matter. And like, I wish I could say I always remember sometimes I wish I remembered an hour ago and like that's on me, and I'm working on that. But as soon as I can remind myself like what really matters here is this important. Then I can circle back to like the goal of I'm trying to raise them to be great people not necessarily to do it exactly like I do it.
Crystal Ware 24:58
Yeah, the reminder I have my Myself is we want to be happy and enjoying what we're doing. Like whatever that is. That is always my goal in life. And that's still you know, the kind of thing that I want to teach other women like how do you create a life that you love and that you enjoy? That is the barometer for me is like, are we having fun? Are we having a good time? Before we
Patricia Sung 25:19
continue on, I want to say thank you to our sponsors whose support allows me to bring you this podcast for free. I've got a podcast for you to check out. I'm so excited to partner with Understood Explains this month. This season of the show is hosted by teacher and special education expert Juliana Urtubey, and it's all about how to navigate IEPs or individualized education plans. This latest season of Understood Explains covers things like how to tell if your child needs an IEP. And it busts through a bunch of misunderstandings about special education. I especially appreciated the episode that explain the difference between 504s and IEPs.
Patricia Sung 25:57
Because when you are the one advocating for your child, the more knowledge that you have on this confusing subject, the more confident you will feel in being able to advocate for your child. All of this season's episodes are available both in English y Espanol. So if you have a child who you think might need an IEP, or maybe your child's IEP is ready to be updated for the upcoming year here in your podcast app, search for Understood Explains and add it to your downloaded episodes so that you can take the listen later today. Again, that's Understood Explains right here in your podcast app.
Crystal Ware 26:31
So my oldest son who struggles with I would say emotional regulation related to ADHD. He's very organized, he is on top of his stuff, for the most part, the emotional regulation. And that's what I talked to him about all the time is like, Is this fun? Are you feeling happy? If it's not, why are you letting these feelings and these negative thoughts on things that really don't matter in the big picture? And that's hard for somebody that doesn't have a worldview, like an adult worldview, right? And I remember when I was a kid, and little things bother you that that's the thing that like, when I'm getting spun up about something, you know, it's almost always trivial, right? It's like, we're not getting upset about the world falling down, or my house is literally on fire. We're getting upset about dumb things in reality that are just started like this. And then it's like the tornado spiral to the top. And it's like, am I about to let this impact my day overshadow what we're doing? Does this really matter? And it always comes back to me about like, the happiness like I want to be happy. And happiness is a choice. Truly, we can be grateful. And we can feel happiness, even when things are not going our way.
Patricia Sung 27:37
Yeah, and I think emotion regulation is like part of ADHD, that's the most difficult and the part that's not talked about, I guess it's talked about the least, like when we kick into gear, when we're upset, it's really hard to turn off that train like it is blazing at 700 miles an hour. And the skills that I'm teaching and coaching, it's like we back up to like, you didn't just flip a switch, something happened earlier in the day that like pushed you a little bit. Yeah, something else pushed a little bit that somebody else pushed a little bit. And when we have EEG, we don't notice that as we're moving through levels like 1234567, even eight, we really don't notice that things are starting to go wrong until like 989 10. And so when we can clue back into ourselves, and notice, like, what is a three feel like? How do I know I'm getting bothered or upset or frustrated when it's like level three or four, because I can do something about it. When it's at level three or four.
Patricia Sung 28:30
I can give myself space to go like, Hey, I'm gonna go step outside for a sec. Or, you know, do something fun, turn on the dance music with your kids. And that will change the environment and change your attitude. It's really hard to change when we're at eight. But when we have HD we tend not to notice any of those beginning numbers. So one of the skills we can learn with ADHD is how do I know myself better? What are those little things like that right now? We had a banana with the fruit flies and we're trying to get you to realize that the kitchen is like these little fruit flies.
Crystal Ware 29:03
Oh my god. By time I fill you and I'm a janitor that I'll tell you later. Okay,
Patricia Sung 29:08
good. Because we've tried I've I was on Good Housekeeping dotcom yesterday, looking at 17 ways to get catch the fruit flies. And so far all of them are 00 for zero on the fruit flies, or a zero for 20. I have zero fruit flies. But it's like those little fruit flies are the things that are bothering us all day long. And yeah, you can deal with fruit flies, number one through 47. And all of a sudden fruit fly 48 I should have put a different number. But that's because we didn't realize that we were getting bothered so much by all those things. And the cumulative effect means that now at bedtime, we're yelling at everybody. Yep.
Patricia Sung 29:46
But if we had taken a few minutes for ourselves before the kids got off the bus instead of running around furiously, you know, rage cleaning, because we realized we didn't get enough stuff done today. Then we may have had capacity to get through the rest of the night. But we can't do that unless we understand like ourselves better and understanding what is using a lot of our energy, what is using a lot of our emotions, and cluing into those so that it's not volcano disaster tornado at the end. And
Crystal Ware 30:13
that just made me think of sending Patricia, that I think is an interesting shift for a lot of working moms too. So if you have a lot of of your audience that are working moms, what I have also noticed in the transition since COVID, and I've shifted from being primarily working people to Office, even if I didn't have a long commute, but working here in my office, and then you know, usually working up until the kids get off the bus, you don't have a space, you don't have a time. And I think that can be impactful to is like no matter what how your day is going, like I'm a positive person, I usually you know, just have fun, I enjoy what I'm doing.
Crystal Ware 30:52
But there are always a little annoyances along the way that you just take in stride, it's no big deal, especially if you're home primarily by yourself, and you don't have anybody else to really get ramped up with. But then to your point, you may not have noticed that you are getting slight frustrations that build up and then your kids come home and you know, it's chaos or whatever is going on it all of a sudden, you're like over the top. And that is what I've realized can be hard for me. And I'm sure that a lot of other moms are struggling with that is like how do you give yourself just a little bit of a break, walk outside, you know, grounded to the earth or whatever it is that works for you, and just have that separation.
Crystal Ware 31:27
But I would imagine that a lot of other working moms that have gone remote, that can be a challenge too, because you don't realize with that little drive commute zone out, listen to music, and how that kind of just get you in a better headspace before you get home. And then, as I call it, the second job begins. I don't know about you, but I thought when the kids were little and our kids went to preschool together, guys, I thought that things would get easier when they went to elementary school, you didn't have to deal with naptime. You didn't have to deal with other things like that. But their schedules are crazy. So it's like literally a second job at 3pm. Yeah,
Patricia Sung 32:01
I think COVID really highlighted that where we all went from like you wherever you were, you had that space to move from work time to mom mode. And I think like this is also the reason that being a stay at home mom is so hard is because you're in moms slash work mode all day, it doesn't end, there is no transition time. And if your kids are in school, it's like you're still you're in just a different version of mom mode. And now you're in a new version of mom mode when they come home. It's like there's not that like space for your brain to be like,
Patricia Sung 32:33
Okay, now I'm shifting. And I think back to like, when our kids were in preschool, the schedule is like nine to 12. Or you could stay until two, it feels like this miniscule amount of time that they're at preschool. It's like by the time you drop them off, and you tried to get a bunch of stuff done. It feels like immediately you're going to pick them up again. Again, there's like no transition, it feels like that time just evaporated. Yeah. And now I'm back to trying to juggle keeping people alive and doing all the things. And so when we don't give ourselves that space is just constant. And that's where the burnout comes from, for a lot of years, and I
Crystal Ware 33:04
don't know about you, but I definitely and, and I was working at that time. So it was my nanny doing that. But she would joke and she's definitely not in a hurry, girl, she is like life is coming at my pace. And that's how it goes. And I honestly I always looked at that, like, I need more of that this is a good feel. But she'd be like, Oh, Mr. Crystal, I cannot do that between nine and 12. They can have the kids I was like, Sure that's three hours. That's a lot of time. But because I wasn't doing it. I didn't realize how tricky that was at all. But I did have the comparison guilt of like, you know, you're making it look so easy. Why did these other moms who I've always recognized even as a working mom, I always recognize that, at least for me, staying at home would have been harder, that would have been a more challenging role for me. But I looked at these moms who had this more challenging job in my mind, and thought they're making it look so easy.
Crystal Ware 33:58
It just looks so natural. They don't have a break from their kids all day, but they seem just so relaxed and so easy. And I think we need to get away from that too. Because we don't really know what's going on back there. You know, we don't know if they're one meltdown away from you know, ripping their hair out. Which I definitely would have been. I would have never I don't know God bless you people that stay at home with their children. I that would have been the hardest job for me.
Patricia Sung 34:22
Yeah, I did it for a while and I was like, This is not for me. It is hard because you're the one driving the schedule to it's all but yeah, okay. I'm like I'm gonna get on a tangent so much time that I still have questions for you. So yes, let's, let's go. Okay, so, one of the things we chatted about before when we were like ooh, which we talked about is that like a lot of times women who have ADHD are often people pleasers and we don't want to rock the boat or we tend to be very much rocking the boat.
Patricia Sung 34:50
We are the bull in the china shop kind of people and but either way, like when you're in a work setting. Both of these extremes are hard to deal with When it comes to like interacting with your boss or having hard conversations, and so it feels like there's a lot of like miscommunications and people are upset. And a lot of times when with ADHD, especially when you don't know and you're not diagnosed, you're like, I don't understand why this keeps going poorly. Why does this keep happening that you started this feeling of like, is it me, because I keep having the same issue with different people have different bosses, or the same boss over and over again. And so what I wanted to like jump into is like, look at both sides of the coin here being somebody who's a people pleaser and doesn't want to rock the boat, and also somebody who says it like they think and then get some flack for that. When we're in a work setting, or if you're not working, like it could be in a volunteer job that you're doing. Like when you're having a conversation with somebody who is in some, like position of authority, how can we have these tough conversations that like we really don't want to have, but we need to have? Yeah, and it was too big. I
Crystal Ware 35:52
can give an example. No. And I can have an example for the ladder as a start. So for your audience who may not know I'm a lawyer by background, I worked in Fortune 500, as a manager, I've been through leadership development, I've helped women have hard conversations on how to get a raise, how to position their expertise, all those things internally, to drive their careers forward in whatever manner they want to get to. And so I have been the ladder a lot of times, and I remember specifically having I was reporting directly to the CFO of a fortune 50, actually. And he told me one time like, you know, Crystal, we got some poor feedback about you. And I was pretty sure I knew the conversation that led to this. And I was thinking, first of all to myself that like why is this other grown man complaining about me, like what is sensitive Sally, but to what we were talking about earlier, like you, Patricia like things to have things right, and you want things done the right way. And when you are working for a company, you want to have the best interest of the company at heart.
Crystal Ware 36:58
And that's what I was doing. And I was like, honestly a little put out that they would complain to me, because I wouldn't give them the answer they wanted to hear. That was really what the crux of the conversation was, they wanted some advice, they wanted to hear something specific. And I was not going to say it because I simply did not agree with it, it wasn't going to be the best for the company. It wasn't what I personally believe, and you're not going to been me, you're not going to been me. And so I might have gotten a little, you know, flabbergasted or frustrated, and that came through. So thankfully, I had enough clout with the company with my boss, everybody knew me, and knew that anytime I got animated in a conversation it was because I very strongly believed in what I was saying.
Crystal Ware 37:37
So that was the end of the conversation. But I took it back as a person that likes personal growth, personal development, wanting to better myself, and you said, you know that the bull in a china swap and a people pleaser, I'm not really a people pleaser. But I do care about people liking me. And if people say they really don't care, I think that's a one in a million person. I think most people do care if other people like them to some degree. And so that kind of bothered me, like why am I being misperceived as like whatever they said, Of course, he didn't tell me exactly what they said. But clearly it was negative. And why would having this, you know, frictional conversation, leave somebody with a negative opinion about me when we simply just didn't agree. And so I took that in and thought about it. And then I took it into how I was going to be a leader and how I had to talk to and interact with many different personalities.
Crystal Ware 38:25
And so what I would say on that is, it really led to eye opening to how I had been for most of my life, which that's my natural personality. When you get into a broader sphere, a bigger company, you are going to work with a lot of different people, and it's the same and can be analogized. With having children, you're not going to have children that operate the same. We can not have the same conversations in the same manner with different people, we have to be aware enough of how somebody is leaving clues in a conversation that they're not feeling comfortable. They're not taking it the way you're meaning it. And so communication is a two way street. And so what I encourage people is to step out, you know, if you have to take a deep breath, but some Sorry, I've got somebody walked into my office, let me put you on hold for a second, get a hold of yourself.
Crystal Ware 39:15
And I never crossed the line of like yelling at anybody out never do anything unprofessional. I have seen people do that though. But what is the pace in your voice? You know, you have a naturally slower cadence when you're talking that I do that alone me talking like this and did it other people have asked me if I'm in New York or no, I'm from Texas, but those kinds of things are small things that you can work on along the way that will make a huge difference in how you're perceived. If you can take your voice down a little bit, even if you're upset, you're going to come across kinder, gentler, more willing to negotiate or willing to come to the same place it does not mean and I want to be very clear about this. It does not mean you have to agree with people on things that you do not agree with to come across as a A good, genuine, nice person. But when we think about a few communication skills that we can do, that's where I say, you know, the pause is important, the cadence of your voice is important.
Crystal Ware 40:11
And the tone of your voice is important. And so if we can focus on those three things, I think we're going to be taken a little bit better. And it is unfortunate that as women, we could have the same way of speaking as a man and we're going to be perceived negatively, it is just a fact, I don't let it bother me it is what it is we have to modulate, we have to regulate. And that's the way it is. On the other side, because I've seen extremely smart and intelligent women who are people pleasers, and they are willing, I don't even say willing, it's like they don't want to, but they end up disagreeing with people. And I think that can be difficult if you're looking to be promoted, or have leadership, get certain kinds of special projects or otherwise, because it subtly says to people in the organization that you're a little bit of a doormat, and that you may not be willing to follow through.
Crystal Ware 41:04
And that is even more difficult for women. When you want to get along, you want to be a people pleaser, you want for things to be happy, you know, and collegial. And you don't want to rock the boat that can be even more difficult. And I think you just need to remind yourself that you're there to do a job that you're there to work together. And that generally people are not going to be upset if you disagree in a professional way. And you explain your positioning. And I think a lot of times that comes from a position of confidence and feeling that you really are the expert on what you're talking about. But I actually do think it's more difficult to overcome the people pleasing. Yeah,
Patricia Sung 41:47
I would say for me, I've had to do a lot of work in therapy to realize that I would change what I was doing, because I was trying to control what the other person thought of me. And so I was doing what I thought they want it. And they didn't realize that that's what I was doing, like deep down in the depths. Like, and so now that I've like worked on working through that, I don't know that I fully mastered it. But realizing that like I don't have control over what other people think of me, no matter what I say, I can't control what they think of me because that comes from their perspective. It comes from their history, their experiences.
Patricia Sung 42:23
So that's not anything that I can control. So if I can't control what they're going to think of me, then I may as well be me because me changing to do something else still isn't going to get me the result I want. And so when we practice that in like some low stakes ways, like I used to do really like silly things, even like if my food wasn't quite right, I'd be like, it's fine. I'll just eat it. I don't want to bother like, no, practicing. Like, if you order something in a restaurant, and it's wrong, saying I'm so sorry.
Patricia Sung 42:50
You know, I ordered this with no cheese, would you please bring me one with no cheese? Or even like you're at the coffee counter and you're like, Excuse me? Could I have a straw? Like some people won't even interrupt the person to get a straw? Like those little ways that you are practicing inconveniencing somebody, quote unquote inconveniencing them and seeing like it's fine, that barista was totally happy to get you a straw. It did not bother them. Yes, maybe the waiter rolled his eyes when he got to the back. But like, if you really don't want cheese, it's okay. You can say you don't want cheese, that is a skill, we may have to practice to be able to like work through that. And it's just scary. For those of us who've always opted for I'd rather shrink back so that there's not conflict.
Crystal Ware 43:34
Yeah, and it can be hard. I mean, I have some very good friends that are non confrontational. And I joke to them about it sometimes or all know that if we're about to have a moment, and I push a little bit like, it's okay, we don't, we're gonna still be friends. We don't have to agree on everything. But those are the people that it makes me really upset to see, because I see them in the corporate sphere getting dumped on, you know, the ones that are sometimes very, very brilliant, but they stayed in the background, they are taking on a lot of work. Sometimes they're taking on a lot of work for a boss that is getting paid double, and they're not doing anything because they're giving all their work to this person.
Crystal Ware 44:10
And that's I mean, at the end of the day it is what is your personality and what is a fit for you. But if you're looking to move ahead, you have to have a voice of some sort. You have to work on a team and you have to be okay having a little bit of conflict. And I think those are great examples of how you can practice that. Because those are everyday things that we can just work on to see. It's not a big deal. I'm just gonna speak up for myself. It doesn't mean I'm getting angry or being mean just advocating for yourself and that is what we as women need to do on a regular basis to continue to propel ourselves forward.
Patricia Sung 44:45
Hey there, Mama. I've got something fun for you. Who doesn't love a quiz? I want to know which mama animal are you because you're not your average Mama Bear. You have a magical ADHD brain that puts a sprinkle of brilliance on everything you do. She Your you may have forgotten that laundry in the washer for the third time. But what are your strengths? What makes your ADHD parenting style unique to you? How do you use that sparkle to bless your family? So which mama animal are you? Find out by taking the quiz, what's your ADHD mama parenting style, because you're not your average Mama Bear, head on over to patriciasung.com/quiz and find out and then when you do, I want you to post your results on social media. So we can see that your hashtag, #notyouraveragemamabear, along with the hashtag #I’mamama and then fill in the animal that you get. Again, that's patriciasung.com/quiz. And I can't wait to see what you get. So tag me and motherhood in ADHD.
Patricia Sung 45:46
Okay, so of course, if we take that like tough conversation stuff that we just talked about, and apply it to like, I want to ask for a raise at work. What would be like your top three things like how to approach that conversation? As somebody who is a confident person or someone who tends to lean towards people pleasing, like either way, how do you approach that conversation to say, I deserve more money?
Crystal Ware 46:07
Yeah. So I mean, I think it's always good to set a few minutes in person just walking by your boss's office saying, Hey, I have an important conversation I want to have with you. Let me know if you have a few minutes today or tomorrow, if you are the more reserved people pleaser type, maybe you feel more comfortable sending an email and saying can we have a few minutes? That's okay. I think regardless of which side you're on, it's important to have a few notes with you. So like, if it's just three or four bullets, even more, so for a more reserved person, they might be more competent to have those. But for somebody that is extremely big personality, the bull in a china shop, I think the one thing that you're gonna have to be conscientious of is you may not get an answer right then.
Crystal Ware 46:49
And you need to realize that it's not going to benefit you to push, push, push in that moment, you can continually subtly push for the background over the next couple of weeks, months, how are things? What will I need to do? But it's more about asking the questions, if you don't get the answer you want right away? What are the follow ups? What can I do? How can I position myself, you're asking for clues for them to give you clues on what they want to see. So that they can advocate on your behalf, it's usually not going to be the next managers ultimate decision. If you're a more soft spoken, non conflict type personality, you're going to need to have more data so that you feel confident so that it's not really a conflict, you need to prove to yourself there is no conflict here.
Crystal Ware 47:36
These are the things that I have achieved, I deserve this, why would there be conflict when I have these facts in front of me to show you and that can be facts of what you've achieved, the projects you've taken on the time you've put in, it could be a result you've driven of you know, I sold this new client and I brought in $10 million for the company. And or it could be market driven, you know, my position I've noticed is being elevated and other companies and I need to also be elevated. So I stay on par These are all factual things that are pretty difficult for another person to argue with. And so there is no conflict. If you come from that place of like, this is uncomfortable to me, but there is really no true conflict, then you can have a little bit more comfort in entering the conversation.
Patricia Sung 48:25
Do you recommend having that conversation just around like the, you know, annual review time? Or is this something that we should be talking about, like throughout the year?
Crystal Ware 48:35
I'll give us a great loyally answer, it depends. It's always easier to get a raise during the annual review time. But I say start the conversation, if you know you're going to want more than the 234 percent the average and you feel you deserve. And you have the support for that start two or three months before because usually the formal process is like four to six weeks. And they kind of already know. So give your boss the opportunity to align things behind the scenes, that will give you the best chance and that's going to be doing it a little bit more in advance. However, if you are about to look for a new position within the company, and you know you want a significant bump, or if you've just finished a project or brought on a new client, maybe those are good times. And those would be off cycle raises.
Crystal Ware 48:35
If there is an opportunity and you feel that you deserve something more, take the opportunity when it presents itself. There's no you know, riding a high wave of an achievement is always going to be a great time, especially if that achievement internally brought in money, then it's like okay, this is a good time to ask. So I say it always depends. You may talk about it at the annual raise, but hey, don't What if you just brought us to a new level of achievement internally, even if you got your 4% raise in January. That doesn't mean you can't deserve to get another one. So there are no hard and fast rules. I mean, big companies have harder and faster rules, there can always be massaged. But there's no hard or fast rules on income and salary and negotiating. So don't hinder yourself with those. If you feel in your heart, you deserve it, find a way to make a plan to get it. And
Patricia Sung 50:17
I think like when we bring ADHD in the mix, a lot of times, we're not as aware of it, because it's not front and center. But then when you know, raise time comes up, then we're like, oh, I need to ask for a raise. But a lot of times, like you were saying, there's that you got a lag time. And if you're in the annual review season, a lot of times the managers have already done their like shifting and moving and wiggling around before they have those conversations. Yeah. Do you want to bring it to their attention before they start allocating all their funds? Because if they only have so much to give, which they probably do, you want them to know, and be reminded of all your achievements before they start thinking about that, because it's a lot harder for them to change things after the fact than if they've already had the meetings and done the organizing and know like who's getting what raises, and then you bring it up.
Patricia Sung 51:02
And they're like, well, but we already decided that like three weeks ago. So if you want to do this, like okay, let's pause right now and say like, When is your review season? Like when does that happen? And put a reminder on your calendar for like two months before that to send that email or have that, you know, pop in the office. Hey, I want to talk to you, when you have a sec, with sufficient time to have that conversation before those conversations are happening behind closed doors.
Crystal Ware 51:27
And I would say to the ADHD brain, don't overthink it. I know it's so I mean, I literally overthink What kind of coffee I'm gonna have. So I am not this is like pot and kettle, right? I'm telling you this. I know it's not always easy, but don't overthink it, just do it. Like Nike says, Let them overthink it, you present the facts of what how amazing how brilliant you are, and let them figure out the rest. You know, don't talk yourself out of it. And so if it's on your heart, and it's on your mind, also, don't wait a month, because you're going to talk yourself out of it. So we've got to understand how our brains work, how we are negotiating with our own internal selves, and get beyond that. And I think that comes from just doing it and not giving ourselves too much time to get scared to talk ourselves out of it to compare ourselves to our colleagues. You know, it's not you versus them. It's just you. So you talk up, you don't worry about what somebody else is doing. Don't worry about what your boss is gonna think. Just ask. Yeah. And
Patricia Sung 52:26
if you have the conversation, like literally tomorrow, even if they're like, well, we can't do raises for another three months, at least they know you've planted the seed. Yeah, yeah, that's actually one of the things you said crystal reminded me of this thing I've been telling myself for probably about the last year is that I'm not going to take any opportunities off the table for myself. Like, I'm not going to be the one who says like, No, you can't do that. No, like, they're not going to want you to be on their podcast. No, that person is not going to want to talk to you. Like, I'm not going to eliminate anything as a possibility before I even jump into it. Right. And that was like a big shift for me to be like, Wow, I was really like you said negotiating with myself. Like before I even started it was like, what? I'm the one who's like,
Crystal Ware 53:12
Yeah, you don't realize you're doing it because it's so much subconscious thoughts going on. And that's why it's like just asked, I know, for the person who doesn't like conflict, getting a no feels like conflict to you. It's like, they don't like me, they don't want me did it. It's not it's not personal. It's just like you presented them with the opportunity. They don't want to go with that. But if you don't ask, you will never get so many times I find that women even more so with ADHD, you're talking yourself out of things before you even know what the other person would think or say. And so it's like, just ask don't overthink it. If it's a no, it's a no. So what you know, the most successful people in the world have heard no, a million times and kept going. That's how they got there. They didn't get there because they took the path of least resistance. They didn't get there by having everybody just love them and follow over them. They got there through a lot of closed doors that they just kept knocking on. Okay, I
Patricia Sung 54:06
have one more question for you. Yeah. And then I don't know if you have any more for me. I posted in my community like hey, what kind of questions you'll have for Crystal and Katie asked for your advice on strategies of how do you balance work and family time, especially in the summer when the kids are home more and you know, schedules have shifted? How do you find balance in that season where things are starkly different from the school year?
Crystal Ware 54:29
I will say this is pretty new to me. So it's also on my mind, this is a great time to ask this question because I had been working more traditionally until the last like two years. So when I put my kids in camp, at least a half day camp or so. And then what I've started to do is like right now I am really trying to get the bigger things that I want to have done off the plate by May so that I'm just doing things that feel easier to me because I'm not like I hate them. If people don't know me in real life, sometimes when I talk about my challengers are very surprised to see that I don't do the things that I feel that are going to be hard. Like we've talked about a lot, me starting my new website and things like that thewelldefinedwoman.com. And the tech of it just makes me crazy.
Crystal Ware 55:16
And I'm like, once I start getting in there, I'm like, okay, I can do this, this is not that challenging. But in my mind, I put that these things are so hard. So I try to do all those kinds of things that I know I'm going to be resistant to before when I have the whole day to like, get things done, and then know that the easier stuff the run of the mill stuff I can do kind of like from my phone, if we're at the park, and then I just have lower expectations like, this is the season of life, this is what I've chosen. This is what I believe, for me, God wants me to be with my children more to invest in them. And I have just got to have lower expectations for myself, which is very hard for me. And I just have to do that that is where we're at.
Crystal Ware 55:58
And I just have to remind myself all the time that life is not a rush, tomorrow will come I can get things done in the time that I get things done, it also means that I need to be more efficient. And sometimes, like I said, I will stare at things and do all the other things that are super easy, instead of the one thing I really need to do. And I have to force myself to be better about that. Because the time is limited. And that's just what it is. So it's having self awareness, understanding your own challenges, having grace with yourself, and then realizing you're not going to get as much done and that is okay, because raising children keeping them alive, loving them dealing with their fighting. That is a job. I think this has been for me awesome. Patricia, I think that this is pulled up a lot of information. I think the only other thing that I had from my perspective that I think is helpful, again, for women with ADHD or without is like what is your biggest piece of advice for women that suffer from perfectionism.
Patricia Sung 56:54
So I have done a lot of personal work on perfectionism, and realizing that it is a coping mechanism, something that kept you safe and took care of you for so long. But it's grown legs and runaway in a way that if you feel like it's perfectionism that it's not serving you like it was meant to originally. And what it comes down to is reminding ourselves that like we are good enough, just as we are, regardless of how many to do list items you've checked off today, like what you've accomplished how many promotions you got, like all that doesn't determine our worth, our worth is inherent because we're people who deserve care. And you don't have to be perfect because that was never the expectation of you.
Patricia Sung 57:42
So there's that fundamental piece, but then the strategic piece is actually practicing not being perfect at stuff and being okay with like be minus work, which is so hard. When you are a perfectionist like I don't know what year it was probably somewhere around like 2021 my word of the year was failure because I made myself do things that I knew I wasn't going to be great at from the start. And usually when you're a perfectionist, you're like, Well, if I know I'm not gonna be great at that I'm not even starting it. Practicing that I made mistakes. I screwed up stuff. I didn't do a great job with that. Like, I really wanted to pick up a calligraphy.
Patricia Sung 58:19
It looks gorgeous. I have not figured it out. The letters always look wonky. Like it's okay, I tried it. It's not the hobby for me. And that's okay. Like, even in those little things like, how can you practice like no risk failure calligraphy, no one's gonna die if my letters aren't formed, right? Like that was just fun. But that's a way that I can practice it not being perfect. And there's no harm. So when you start to tell your brain like, it's okay that I messed this up, I'm still okay, I'm still safe, even though I made these mistakes. That's how you can start to rewrite that narrative in your head that you have to be perfect all the time. Yeah. And
Crystal Ware 58:54
just doing it. I mean, that's, I would say that I started learning tennis in the last year and a half. And I didn't want to go to these classes, because I was like, I'm going to be the worst. Well, guess what I am pretty much the worst one in the dropping classes. But I've gotten significantly better. So like if I didn't go because I was worried about what everybody else was going to say, or how I perceive my performance, and was I worthy of being in this group, I would not be playing as well as I am now. I mean, like somebody is always the worst at something. I mean, even like in professional golf, like there's somebody always at the bottom of the leaderboard, it just is what it is doesn't mean they don't deserve to be there. Yeah, I always
Patricia Sung 59:30
remind myself too, that like, for example, like when you're in the tennis class, and you realize you're not the best one. Most of the people really aren't paying attention to everybody else. We just don't have capacity to pay that much attention to other people. But the people that are noticing that you're not doing a good job are probably the other perfectionists which again, it's going back to like, that's their perspective, because they're feeling like they have to be good at everything all the time. And that's a reflection on them not on me. So I'm gonna go out there. I actually took my first tennis lesson yesterday. Like I am Not good.
Crystal Ware 1:00:02
It's not easy. It is hard. And I
Patricia Sung 1:00:04
played softball. So like the whole angling the the racket thing is a whole new world. And if someone else is making a comment about my terrible tennis skills, that's a reflection on them. It's not a reflection on me. I'm the one who's out here on the court trying to get better that's worth celebrating. Yeah, not the person who's judging from the sidelines. So
Crystal Ware 1:00:23
exactly. But that's been a long winded I heard a saying the other day, and I think this is a prevalent thing, but it's like, you know, the only people that are going to stand around telling you shouldn't couldn't aren't doing it well, are the ones that are not doing it. The ones that are doing it are going to support you celebrate you and push you forward and encourage you to keep going. So do you want to listen to the naysayers? Or do you want to listen to the people that are out there doing it?
Patricia Sung 1:00:44
I want my advice from the people on the court.
Crystal Ware 1:00:46
Yeah, exactly. Well, I think this went well. And I think we have so much gold for everybody here.
Patricia Sung 1:00:51
I know. There's so many times I kept jotting down like oh, that was a good one. Yeah, before we wrap up, I do want to ask you a lightning round questions. Okay, great, super fast. Like literally don't think about it, just answer. And then at the end, we'll we'll tell everybody where to find us. And that way the ladies listening can connect. Alright, number one, the best thing that I've read or listened to recently is, I
Crystal Ware 1:01:10
always recommend oh my gosh, the book. It's on my nightstand. Why do I it's a fable. Oh, it's gonna drive me crazy. I'm not good at remembering things. I only remember things that are like, totally important. But I recommend this book for everybody. And I will give it to you and we can put it in the show notes. I recommend I read it every year, because I just think it helps you what is your destiny? Where are you going? And it's a short 120 page or something book sold like 100 million copies. That's gonna drive me crazy. Okay,
Patricia Sung 1:01:38
we'll put in the show notes. Alright, number two, my most boring about me. Fact is I
Crystal Ware 1:01:44
hate doing the dishes, like literally hate doing the dishes. And so I let everybody else do the dishes.
Patricia Sung 1:01:53
Number three, when I'm having a rough day, my go to quote song poem, book, podcast activity, whatever it is.
Crystal Ware 1:02:00
I try to sit in the sun and remind myself that I am grateful that I am blessed and that God gave me a purpose. And you're living it.
Patricia Sung 1:02:07
Okay, number four. Don't tell anyone I
Crystal Ware 1:02:12
an adult show, right? Don't tell anybody I read slightly somebody books.
Patricia Sung 1:02:18
Number five. If I had a magic fairy wand for one spell,
Crystal Ware 1:02:22
I would, I would give myself triple patience. That's a good one. Okay.
Patricia Sung 1:02:27
And number six. My best piece of advice for mamas with ADHD is
Crystal Ware 1:02:32
grace is give yourself Grace every day is a new day. And be patient with yourself and not too hard on yourself.
Patricia Sung 1:02:39
Okay, so don't tell the moms, where can they find you? I am for people
Crystal Ware 1:02:42
that you know, are into building a career business, whatever it is, I am pretty active on LinkedIn at Crystal Ware risk strategist, and then I'm building out my new site. It is live. But it's not totally populated yet, but it is thewelldefinedwoman.com where I want to encourage everybody to build the well defined lie that you deserve that you are worth. And that looks different for everybody. But we all have a shared vision of making our dreams become a reality. And I'm also on Instagram, but you know, kind of what about you? Oh,
Patricia Sung 1:03:18
you can find me at patriciasung.com or motherhoodinadhd.com. So that's my handle on all my social media and everything as well. And you can head over to my website, there's patriciasung.com/toolkit. And there I've got literally like a bazillion resources. So like if you want to look at like a symptom checklist of like real life, what is ADHD look like? For like a grown woman. There's so many things are how to calm down, there's a whole pile of them. So go grab some support this free, and I would love to see you at, like we have a community that meets every Wednesday, we have a retreat coming up in October. So yeah, come meet your people. If all this is all resounding with you, you know, find the people that they get you and make friends and find support. Like we don't have to do this alone. So
Crystal Ware 1:04:03
no. And I would say that is the biggest thing of where where we are in the world is women having less community than we ever had in our lives. And so if you are feeling alone, there is a community for you. Yeah, somewhere. And I encourage you if that is the biggest thing. The biggest blessing to me is like where we live, we have a good community. But I highly encourage because I think that we are meant to live and work and do life together as women. But our society has not put it that way. And so that is the other reason I wanted to create this website, where it is like its own little community and we will be having retreats in the future also. But that is I think the biggest thing I think we would see an improvement in mental health if women had more resources to be together. So awesome. Well,
Patricia Sung 1:04:52
thank you so much. I really enjoyed this and we totally went longer than I said we went so thank you. It was a good conversation. Yeah,
Crystal Ware 1:04:59
thank you too. here
Patricia Sung 1:05:02
for more resources classes and community head over to my website motherhoodinadhd.com.